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Vigorous Steve: The Man Who Dethroned the Liver King

 

By Rick Collins, Esq.

 

Vigorous Steve is one of the most popular fitness coaches on social media today. With 70,000 peeps on his YouTube channel (www.youtube.com/user/VigorousSteve), a popular website (http://vigoroussteve.com/) and a growing Instagram account, Steve is amassing an impressive  following. He has provided coaching and other personalized services to over 1,000 individuals over the span of 15 years. These days, he does little one-on-one coaching and focuses instead on uploading short, no-nonsense video clips on highly specific topics surrounding anabolic-androgenic steroids (AAS) and other performance-enhancing drugs (PEDs) directed at maximizing anabolic gains while reducing harmful effects. We arranged this interview after spending some time together at the Olympia Weekend in Las Vegas.

 

RC: You just spent two weeks in the United States. How does the bodybuilding scene in the U.S. compare to either Holland, where you were raised, or where you now live in Thailand?

 

VS: Judging by my short time visiting the gyms and Mr. Olympia in Las Vegas, I can say that the bodybuilding community is as welcoming and as hospitable as it is in Thailand. From what I remember, we didn’t get many fitness tourists passing through the gyms in Holland when I still lived there. But in Thailand, there are always new faces and new upcoming talent passing through. The veteran lifters that are part of the décor usually take the time to help visitors get set up and provide information as a local “Tripadvisor.” I felt the exact same in Las Vegas, albeit that it was the biggest draw of bodybuilders in one place I’d ever seen. I think bodybuilders and people into health and fitness are the same everywhere: open, friendly, talkative, easygoing, and genuinely interested in your journey, just like you are in theirs. It felt great to be among so many like-minded people, traveling from all over the world to walk around the Olympia Expo and watch the Mr. Olympia competition. I can’t wait to do it all over again in November!

 

RC: I’ll be there for sure! Hey, I visited Thailand a few years back and found the PED scene to be quite different. Tell us more about the current steroid market there.     

 

VS: The pharmacies in Thailand sell a very wide range of pharmaceuticals, including steroids and other PEDs which are used in our fitness community. Technically, the large majority of these drugs are meant to be sold on prescription only. In reality, prescriptions are rarely required, meaning you can buy a very broad selection of PEDs, over the counter, no questions asked. Thailand, just like any other country, has rules regarding the sale and distribution of medication, although these rules are seldom enforced at the pharmacies. That being said, buying PEDs in Thailand can be quite a minefield. As a general rule of thumb, the pharmaceuticals which are on display within the pharmacy itself, either behind glass or clearly visible from the shelves, are Thai FDA-approved medications that are registered in Thailand and can legally be sold (on prescription, if required). Whatever an entrepreneurial pharmacy in a popular tourist area might sell from the back of the shop is generally from an Underground Lab (UGL), or a pharmaceutical imported from Turkey, Pakistan or India, for example, that isn’t registered by the Thai FDA. These medications are still considered pharmaceutical grade, but are not available on prescription through the hospitals. UGL products are either produced locally, or imported from India, Malaysia or Cambodia, and sold for distribution all over the world. Thailand is one of the largest steroid distribution hubs in the world, attracting dealers from many European, Arab and Asian countries. Personally, I would advise everybody to avoid any and all UGLs that are sold in Thailand, as the carrier oils used are generally highly inflammatory and deleterious to your health, especially with prolonged exposure. If you’re unsure if a particular brand or product is a legitimate pharmaceutical or not, consult the Thai National Drug Information Database here: http://ndi.fda.moph.go.th/drug_info

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RC: We recently lost a popular fitness YouTuber, Leo Rex of Leo and Longevity, at only 34 years old, in Thailand. Tell us about your relationship with him, and what lessons we can learn about his early demise.

 

VS: Myself, Derek of More Plates More Dates, and Leo, used to record a podcast called “The Supraphysiological Man; BioBros” in 2021 and 2022. It was highly popular at the time, as we would discuss various topics that were centered around biohacking, longevity, male hormone optimization, overall male performance, relationships, steroids and performance-enhancing drugs, the latest developments in the fitness industry, and much, much more. Leo often had blowouts with other people in the fitness industry and was often highly critical of other respected industry members. I tried to warn him several times that this kind of behavior is heavily frowned upon, and that it wasn't doing much good for his overall reputation and perception of him as an expert. Leo had a very hard time with receiving the slightest amount of criticism, or friendly suggestions for that matter. He would rarely accept advice; if anything, he’d try to make you feel bad for even recommending certain things in the first place. I grew more distant from him as our collaborations continued.

 

After the 10th episode, a domestic abuse charge that Leo’s wife filed against Leo surfaced, which contained some disparaging text messages about Leo’s relationship with Derek. We understood that this report was showing the absolute worst side of Leo, and we wanted to give him time to find the words to explain himself. Honestly, I was very upset by what I read in the report, and I knew how he would react when I’d offer my help and advice on the matter, so I didn't even try to reach out.

 

A few months later Leo showed up in Thailand to work with Tony Huge. We exchanged some unpleasant words over WhatsApp during the Liver King situation, but we solved our indifferences the same day and agreed to not get in each other’s way and enjoy our time in Thailand. That was the only and last interaction I had with Leo until I heard that he passed away in Pattaya. At the moment of this interview, the exact causes of his death are unknown, and I do not wish to speculate on what happened. I’m in direct contact with his ex-wife Lucie, to offer my assistance wherever I can.

 

Leo was an extreme biohacker, but I’m unsure if his lifestyle choices led to his death, or if it was a one-in-a-million freak accident that caused him to die of his wounds. I really don’t know, and I wish we had the answers so we could learn from what happened. I know that’s what Leo would’ve wanted. We’ve reviewed pro bodybuilders’ blood work and autopsy reports on BioBros to help educate our audience about what could potentially go wrong when you use pharmacology to enhance your life. All I can say now is that no matter how hard or difficult life might be at times, it’s OK to ask for help. You can’t repeatably push people away and hurt them verbally because you have your own demons to battle. I think Leo could've been one of the greatest and smartest people in our industry if he learned to control his emotions and chosen his words more carefully at times. From the sounds of it, he didn't have too many friends left, and the ones that were still in his corner knew he needed days by himself to get his mind in the right state for normal social interactions. There were lots of friends willing to help him these last couple of years, but I think he alienated most of them, and would rather help others than really seek help for himself.

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RC: Let’s talk about things here in America. The U.S. Congress launched a War on Steroids in 1990, putting anabolic steroids in the same legal framework with cocaine and heroin. What are your thoughts on that, and do you think the approach is effective in getting gear out of the hands of either cheating athletes or teenagers?

 

VS: It’s an unfortunate situation, as hard restrictions like this force the fitness community to source their PEDs through an “illegal” underground network, which further complicates the health risks associated with anabolic steroids and the other drugs used. Many pharmaceutical companies are fully aware that a large chunk of their medications somehow find their way onto the underground network for bodybuilders to use recreationally. I wish some of these restrictions will be lifted as they are being lifted on Marijuana for example. This way the government can actually profit from recreational drug use through taxes, and the end consumer has a broader selection of high-quality PEDs, without having to look over their shoulders and dabble in the gray area to follow their fitness aspirations. While TRT clinics are a great start, the selection of pharmaceuticals that they can work with is rather limited. Nowadays, some bodybuilders source a part of their protocol, legally, through a clinic under doctor supervision, and while they’re not under doctor supervision, they collect whatever they can find on the underground network and use UGL products haphazardly without much guidance at all. I wish everything could be brought under one roof within the next couple of years, although I don’t think that will actually happen…

 

Personally, I don’t consider it cheating when athletes use PEDs to improve their performance, especially when they compete professionally and support their team, and family, by doing so. Whether PEDs are legal or not, athletes will do anything to get an edge over the competition. That includes hyperbaric chambers, infrared saunas, ice baths, intravenous anti-aging treatments, blood doping, etc. It’s all part of sports, it’ll never go away, so why not level the playing field and allow every little advantage imaginable? I’m looking forward to all the insane world records that will be set once the veil is lifted!

 

Teenagers will do what teenagers will do. Buying steroids or SARMs online is just as easy as asking your older cousin to buy alcohol for you: those who want it, will find a way. Steroid education is a double-edged sword. On one hand, it’s good that there’s so much high-quality information about safer practices and use models available now. On the other hand, that also inspires teenagers to take these drugs earlier, as they feel they have a fundamental grasp on where to source them, how to take them, and how to mitigate short-term and long-term side effects. Many teenagers will still mess themselves up in the process; success stories are spaced far and few between. Most teenage steroid users will not accomplish much in the sport, besides a face full of pimples and a chest full of gynecomastia!

 

RC: Let’s get the elephant in the room out of the way. Many people know you as the whistleblower who recently leaked old email exchanges (back from the summer of 2021) revealing that Brian “Liver King” Johnson (www.liverking.com) was a fake natty. Johnson had built a financial empire in part around his claims that eating raw animal organs was the key to his ridiculously jacked physique. The revelations of his steroid use have prompted at least one $25 million dollar lawsuit despite his public apology. You’ve been clear about why you felt obligated to blow the whistle (www.youtube.com/watch?v=_m2aTFhzRKk), but my question now is, would you still have done it?

 

VS: I’ve been contemplating the precarious situation for over 1.5 years and I’m still conflicted on the whole ordeal. I do feel that I should’ve outed these lies much earlier, before the lies and persona became as convoluted as it turned out to be. I would have still preferred to be left out of the conversation and not be known as a whistleblower, or the former coach who leaked these emails. But what is done is done; his steroid usage would’ve come to the forefront eventually, just like it did with Lance Armstrong and so many other athletes subject to drug testing.

 

Whereas I have no issues with athletes using PEDs to become more competitive in sports, since most people on their team, and the opposing team, are most likely using PEDs too, I have a problem with selling a pipe dream filled with false expectations to the general population, introducing them to the fitness community based on a giant lie.

 

Keep in mind that Brian himself, and a co-worker of Ancestral Supplements, also sent emails to Derek of More Plates More Dates (https://www.youtube.com/c/MorePlatesMoreDates) confirming his PED usage, which also ended up in the video exposing “The Liver King Lie” (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKpmAGZQetc).

 

What a lot a people forget is that I dropped him as a client and refunded him the coaching fee in full, after 2-3 weeks of miscommunication and a ton of red flags. Without stirring the pot any further, let’s just say that I was more concerned for his health than he was, after 15 years of coaching bodybuilders and various competitive athletes, I know a trouble when I see it.

 

It would’ve been significantly worse if I remained in his corner all this time as his secret drug guru, while he was lying through his teeth on every podcast, within or outside of our fitness community. I still feel horrible for Mark Bell, Paul Saladino and other prominent figures who bought into the whole façade.

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RC: I guess people sometimes just want to believe, despite the obvious. Switching topics, most of the older bodybuilding fans here know that Arnold and Franco had no coaches and Lou Ferrigno just had his father. When did prep coaches become so critical to the sport? Describe the role that coaches play pre-contest, and even for non-competitive lifters who just want to look better?

 

VS: Bodybuilding has evolved tremendously since the early days. It has become increasingly competitive, the physiques get more muscular, more separated, leaner, drier, etc. There are tons of variables that the athlete needs to think about, which can be hard toward the end of a contest prep. This is where a prep coach comes into the picture, taking all the second-guessing and troubleshooting away from the competitor. Instead, they can now solely focus on execution of the jobs they need to do to peak their physique perfectly on the day of the competition. Nowadays there’s no room for error anymore, a small deviation can turn a stellar award-winning physique into a blurry bloated mess, which could mean the difference between first place and fifth place competing at the highest level.

 

Besides a contest-prep coach, high-level athletes often have deep-tissue massage therapists, private doctors, training partners, sponsors, a supportive partner and parents in their corner to help them attain their goals. Having an entire support team available makes the larger-than-life physiques on the Mr. Olympia stage possible! From my experience coaching a lot of athletes at the Asian and World Championships, I can say that a coach can be anything between a stern father figure, a role-model older brother, a dietitian, a personal trainer, a physiotherapist, a posing instructor, a competition color applicator, an unqualified rogue prescribing doctor or nurse, and a mad scientist that bridges the gap between scientific evidence and alchemy, for the whole thing to come together for one hour onstage.

 

Coaches are also highly beneficial for regular lifestyle clients who just want to exceed and reach their goals faster. Instead of learning the hard way through trial and error, a coach can piece things together faster, and guide clients toward their goals, with few hiccups along the way. That’s why I do feel that it’s very important to work with an experienced coach who has been around the block and had a few rodeos themselves. Nobody wants to get their teeth examined by the intern dentist either, right?

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RC: Agreed! But from the legal perspective, there are differences between advising a client about safe use, recommending specific sources, and actually providing the drugs. A prep guru was recently indicted for providing a Schedule I drug that allegedly resulted in a death. Tell me more about how coaches navigate these tricky waters.

 

VS: In most cases, the client knows exactly what they get themselves into and the coach guides them through the process of use. Some coaches are “safer” in their practices than others, and the same can be said for the client. I know that every coach reading this interview right now can count several instances where a client pushed the boundaries of drug use far beyond what the coach recommended, or felt comfortable with. My personal advice would be to drop these clients ASAP, let them guide themselves toward death if they choose. The longer you stay in their corner, the more of a liability it becomes. Confidence between the coach and client builds over time. Once the coach is more familiar with the client’s health, work ethic, dedication and genetic response to pharmacology, riskier drug protocols might be discussed. While these are considered “riskier” for general population that don’t have a fundamental grasp of their health and response, for dedicated and experienced high-level bodybuilders these protocols could mean the difference between first and second place, or placing out of the top five. Some physiques are more resilient to pharmacology than others, but that takes time to figure out, and this is not something that should be done right from the start.

 

In many cases, coaches point their clients in the right direction of where to acquire reputable pharmaceuticals, but do not provide the pharmaceuticals themselves, under any circumstance. It’s one thing to say, “Coach John Doe told me to buy these steroids on this website, or from this source by email” vs. “Coach John Doe sold me these steroids himself, here is the Bitcoin transaction ID.”

 

As a coach, you have to be extremely careful on what you recommend to your clients. If anything you should always tread on the side of caution and force the athlete to do blood work, organ imaging and preventative health screening, before you recommend anything regarding the use of PEDs, at all. I’ve always made sure that my clients were in a good state of health, or willing to improve their health, before my knowledge regarding PED use became available.

 

I think a lot of coaches are overly confident; after a few success stories they start to play god or play doctor, and think they can fix any medical condition or promote highly risky contest-prep protocols to their clients. This is the main reason why athletes die, and will continue to keep dying. Coaches are overconfident, and clients blindly follow them while sticking their heads in the sand thinking that they’ll be OK, because they feel OK. Heart failure comes on quick, often without notice, or after both the coach and client have been ignoring the signs for a while because they wanted to make a name for themselves.

 

I highly doubt that a lengthy disclaimer, or contract, or non-disclosure agreement, would hold up in court, when the family of the client that passed away sues the culprit coach for malpractice, negligence or murder.

 

RC: True, you can’t disclaim away gross negligence, recklessness or criminal conduct. More caution is definitely warranted. You’re a big proponent of regular testing of blood markers to favor harm reduction. As a coach, I’m sure you’ve seen hundreds of lab results on your clients. You’ve made the point that no drug is “safe.” What are the most common adverse side effects you’ve seen, and what were the worst?

 

VS: Honestly, it’s all over the place, some people are very resilient and can run 1,000s of milligrams of steroids, with some ancillaries, peptides and exotics on the side, with little negative effect on their blood work in the short term, as well as in the long term. Organ health doesn’t seem to be impacted negatively as proven with various imaging techniques.

 

Others get all the common side effects at hormone replacement therapy dosages: acne, gyno, hair loss, water retention, insomnia, sleep apnea, anger management issues, etc. I’ve seen it all at this point.

 

What I do feel should be common practice is that people really do their absolute best to focus on their health, and treat health management as a full-time job, before they even consider PEDs to begin with. Many people use TRT/HRT as a coping mechanism, as a midlife crisis red sports car, as the main solution for their obesity, lack of motivation, libido, etc. In reality, many of these issues can be addressed with lifestyle changes, smart supplementation that complements a solid and sustainable diet model, and frequent visits to the gym. Adopt a healthy lifestyle first, do that for a few months to a year to really get comfortable with this lifestyle, before you look into PEDs!

 

Long-term drug users need to understand the cumulative negative effect that PEDs have on your health, especially as they get older. The body doesn’t metabolize the drugs the same, resilience goes down, and age starts to take its toll, which ultimately dictates how your body responds to the drugs. A 1,000 mg steroid cycle in your 20s or 30s might not be possible anymore in your 40s or 50s. Health management gets increasingly cumbersome and complicated later on in life; if you want to continue with your performance enhancing drug journey, you need to become just as knowledgeable about health management to ensure you don’t run into severe issues later on in life.

 

Keep in mind that there’s little you can do about cardiovascular disease, plaque buildup or impaired kidney function. These issues manifest over years to decades. Every little mistake compounds, and you will regret a lot of them once you’re met with a health condition that could’ve easily been prevented if you only did the preventative health screening from the start!

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RC: Health is, indeed, wealth. Now that we understand your stance on health management and risk mitigation, would you care to share a bit more about why you decided to drop Liver King as a coaching client?

 

VS: Judging by his blood work results, his diet model, his protruding stomach, and excessive growth hormone abuse, I speculated he was suffering from nonalcoholic fatty liver disease (NAFLD). This is one of the reasons why I wanted him to do additional health screening. Particularly an ultrasound or fibro scan of his liver, to determine if there was indeed a buildup of fat, and the severity of the disease, if present. There are several grades of NAFLD; most are healable with caloric restriction and certain health supplements or medications. Full-blown nonalcoholic steatohepatitis (NASH) is (severe) inflammation of the liver, fat accumulation and potential liver damage. In later stages of NASH, the inflammation and liver damage can cause fibrosis, or scarring, of the liver. Over time, NASH can lead to cirrhosis and liver cancer. With the amount of growth hormone that he was taking, that condition needed to be ruled out, or addressed immediately, if present, with a complete lifestyle overhaul to prevent the issue from getting any worse.

 

The reason why I drew that conclusion at the time is because I just overcame my own bout of NAFLD, which took months to finally resolve. I’ve documented this entire journey over several videos on my YouTube channel. NAFLD is a poorly understood disease among the fitness and bodybuilding community, but a lot more common than people think. In most cases, NAFLD is caused by excessive caloric intake over longer periods of time, particularly simple sugars and saturated fats. An inflammatory lifestyle also highly contributes to the development of NAFLD. Albeit that the carnivore diet is generally a very anti-inflammatory diet, the saturated fats are certainly plentiful, and the Liver King topped those off with a high amount of maple syrup to meet his carbohydrate requirements.

 

Drug intake, and frequent exercise will mask some of the symptoms of NAFLD, as body fat levels might be low, and certain blood work markers, which are generally elevated in cases of NAFLD or NASH, might still be in range, or within acceptable parameters. Hence, organ imaging is required to really determine what’s going on internally, and if there’s a health issue that needs to be addressed. Unfortunately, I was not able to convince him to get an ultrasound or fibro scan done at the time, and I decided it was best to let him go.

 

To this day, I wonder if he ever did the imaging required to determine if he has NAFLD or NASH, or if he continued with his risky PED usage to maintain his physique in a marketable shape. It’s highly ironic to me that a guy who proclaims to be the “Liver King” had all the signs of liver disease.

 

RC: What do you say to critics who say that such discussions should be undertaken only by medical professionals?

 

VS: There are no medical professionals qualified to guide top-level athletes toward victory. They can do their absolute best to keep these athletes healthy, as many coaches try to do also. But winning the big prize is ultimately about compromises and splitting hairs; that’s where experienced coaches come into the picture. Ultimately, medical professionals are bound by their medical license, which took them over a decade to acquire – why risk it for an athlete trying to get first place?

 

That being said, progressive medical professionals are certainly a welcome addition to the field of enhanced bodybuilding and other sports. Nowadays there are plenty of highly experienced doctors and patient care coordinators who work with individuals who take PEDs recreationally. They understand the benefits, the risks, and most importantly, how to mitigate long-term harm and are able to offer a balanced approach, working with the patient/client, not against them.

 

From my experience, there are a lot of men out there who would like a bit more quality-of-life improvements compared to what a progressive medical professional with a medical license is willing to offer or prescribe. That’s where experienced bodybuilding coaches, like myself, can fill in the gaps and offer a few more recommendations, assuming the client is in a good state of health to begin with!

 

RC: You mentioned TRT (testosterone replacement therapy), which a lot of guys are on. For overall body composition and appearance, how far can someone get on TRT without going to supraphysiologic doses?

 

VS: It really depends on the individual, their metabolic rate, their bodyweight, their activity levels, their injection frequency, which testosterone ester they prefer to use, whether they inject Intramuscular or subcutaneously, if they’re using an aromatase inhibitor to reduce the conversion into estradiol, or a 5-alpha-reductase inhibitor to reduce the conversion into dihydrotestosterone (to prevent hair loss). Also, if they’re using any medication that prevents the breakdown of testosterone through Cytochrome P450 enzyme inhibition. There are so many variables when it comes to TRT, some men only need 100 mg exogenous testosterone per week to get toward the top of the reference range, while others might need 200 mg per week. What is however, incredibly rare, is that men of any age or ethnicity end up looking like a competitive bodybuilder only using TRT. I’m not saying it’s impossible, as several professional bodybuilders have turned pro without the use of PEDs. But the number of bodybuilders in the fitness industry that say they solely rely on medically supervised and prescribed TRT to attain their top 0.1 percent muscularity, I would say that 99.9 percent of those guys are lying. Of course, none of these guys would ever post their blood work results publicly or agree to a random WADA urine test. The audience always needs to realize that lying, or white lies, are a huge part of the public persona, because the general population doesn’t understand what TRT entails, and there’s no way to do a full-blown steroid cycle legally.

 

To answer the question: I think that men can go very far without TRT, and even further with TRT. How far they can go is ultimately determined by their dedication. If you’re sleeping according to your circadian rhythm, ensure a stress-free environment most of the year, treat your nutrition like a full-time job, supplement accordingly and structure your workouts intelligently, you should be able to develop a respectable physique without TRT. But with TRT, this level of dedication turns a respectable physique into a phenomenal physique, compared to the general population. Most won’t win a bodybuilding or men’s physique contest on TRT only, but quality of life will improve substantially if you tick all the boxes.

 

Quick note about TRT: personally, I feel that FULL hormone replacement therapy is superior to cookie-cutter testosterone replacement therapy. Over time, neuro-steroid production and estrogen balance deteriorates in most men on TRT. Instead, look into a lower dose of testosterone through daily subcutaneous micro-administrations, using longer esters like enanthate or cypionate to reduce the conversion into estradiol and dihydrotestosterone. All while supplementing with diindolylmethane (DIM) to sustain a favorable balance between estrone (E1), estradiol (E2) and estriol (E3), as well as supplemental DHEA and pregnenolone to sustain neuro-steroid levels year-round. Men looking to preserve their fertility should look into recombinant human chorionic gonadotropin (rhCG) like Merck Ovitrelle alongside their HRT protocol, and consider a low-dose recombinant human growth hormone (rhGH) and perhaps thyroxine (T4) or Armour Thyroid (T3 and T4) if blood work shows that thyroid parameters change after exogenous rhGH is introduced. Most men do far, far better on a protocol like this, compared to the generic bi-weekly test cyp injections + Arimidex protocol that’s prescribed by most TRT clinics!

 

RC: Sure, a comprehensive hormonal approach to male aging is the way to go. What about the other end of the age spectrum? There’s a perception that young lifters today are starting gear way too early. What do you say to kids who haven’t even built a foundation?

 

VS: Get off Instagram, TikTok and YouTube, and get back into the real world. Most kids are heavily influenced by social media influencers that appear to be successful in all aspects of life, because they’re using steroids at an early age, too. I can say that over the years, many of these young influencers on steroids have reached out to me, to help them with their acne, gyno, hair loss, erectile dysfunction, mood changes, anger management issues, depression, severe insecurities, etc. All the issues these influencers never EVER dare to show on social media but are far more prevalent than the audience probably realizes.

 

Social media dopamine hits have brought people’s attention spans down to seconds. Scrolling endlessly through the insane physiques which are presented online truly warps people’s perspective, both young and old. While everybody on social media looks insane, most only look insane for a few weeks out of the year, but buffer those pictures and share them consistently throughout the time they don’t look insane, but hide away in a hoodie. Social media isn’t real life, it’s 100 percent fabricated. All I can say to the young kids nowadays is to go dark/offline for a few days, and count how many insane physiques, or people on steroids they encounter during the day, gym excluded. It’s probably 0.

 

Besides, there’s the usual advice for kids to be patient, to build their foundation first, learn how to love heavy and intense lifting, learn how to love cooking, learn how to love bringing your meals everywhere and make healthy choices when you’re unable to bring meals yourself, learn to love everything that goes into the fitness lifestyle basically.

 

Once that’s attained over years, then they’ll have to learn how to fall in love with research about health in relation to pharmacology. No matter how you look at it, the PEDs detract from your health, and increase the need for overall health management. Hiring a coach helps, but you still need to understand what you’re putting in your body, and what the short and long-term consequences could be.

 

Unfortunately, for many people out there, enhancement is just a phase, and not a complement to an intense passion for fitness which was already there for years, or ideally, a decade!

 

RC: A lot of young guys are using SARMs (selective androgen receptor modulators). You’ve been very down on SARMs. Can you share why?

 

VS: Based on all the scientific evidence and clinical trials I’ve examined over the years, I don’t think that they’re a suitable replacement for AAS in the context of muscle building. Besides the fact that most SARMs have already been abandoned during clinical trials, the real-world application doesn’t seem to match up to AAS at all. Plus, with AAS, we have decades worth of scientific evidence to pull ideas and concepts from, not to mention the millions of anecdotal reports of fitness enthusiasts documenting their experiences with AAS online. That doesn’t mean that SARMs might not be a suitable replacement in certain medical settings, which is the context in which SARMs are examined currently, and some are still undergoing clinical trials for particular medical conditions. These trials are often performed in single milligram dosages, in which case some SARMs offer less virilizing side effects compared to traditionally used AAS for a comparable amount of expected anabolism. However, this doesn’t translate to double-digit milligram dosages, in which case the selectivity of SARMs is lost. Similar to how the beta-blocker nebivolol loses selectivity for the beta-1 adrenergic receptor when administrations exceed 10 mg per day, after which the medication also blocks the beta-2 adrenergic receptors. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2697096/

 

Long story short, SARMs are far from selective at dosages that would potentiate a significant amount of anabolism that anybody in our fitness community would be happy with. That means that most effective dosages of SARMs will still induce all the negative effects of your health markers, and other virilizing side effects, generally associated with AAS. And to make things worse, from all the blood work I’ve seen over the years, it seems that SARMs worsen health parameters more, compared to currently pharmaceutically prescribed AAS, both at dosages that would yield a comparable amount of strength and muscularity.

 

RC: What have you learned from your many years of coaching that most surprised you?

 

VS: Lying to your coach about your actual drug use, or filtering your weekly progress pictures in Adobe Lightroom. You’re hiring a coach for a reason, to help you from start to finish, because you can’t completely do it by yourself. You’re making it a lot harder than it needs to be, and you’re not instilling much confidence in the coach-client relationship right from the beginning. No client will ever receive the proper help they need without full transparency.

 

RC: What’s the best advice you can give lifters who want to look better without hopping on gear?

VS: Don’t follow advice from people on gear; our bodies are continuously supercharged and we can get away with a lot of mistakes that drug-free athletes can’t get away with. I always defer to the team over at 3D Muscle Journey. They’ve been around for decades, Dr. Eric Helms is highly knowledgeable and works with some of the best coaches, all specialized into maximizing the potential of drug-free athletes. Also; Patience, Patience, Patience, keep realistic expectations, it takes years to get an education and become an expert in your chosen field, and it’ll take years to develop a complete physique when you omit the option of pharmacologic aids.

 

RC: You’re a wealth of information. Any final words of wisdom for MD readers?

 

VS: For those that are coming toward the tail-end of their bodybuilding journey and struggle with downsizing, keep in mind that you’re more than a physique! You can easily shift (some of) your insane relentless dedication to bodybuilding into another endeavor, like business, or raising children, or traveling, or anything you put on the back burner while chasing size and strength. I know it’s freaking hard to see yourself shrink over time, but take it from me, you can sustain a respectable amount with very little effort or PEDs for that matter. You won’t sustain your all-time best; hopefully you’ll have some impressive pictures to reminisce about those days. Just don’t let it define you, and don’t compare yourself to those days. All good things pass, and everything you’ve learned along the way, you can channel into new good things.

 

I’m probably just telling myself this now that I’m preparing to have kids, as I’m not entirely sure how much of my selfish bodybuilding aspirations I can maintain over the next couple of years. I know Muscular Development has been around forever, so I’m assuming that most of the current readers are into their late 30s, 40s or 50s, and fighting to hold on to their former glory, just like I am!

 

Enjoy the journey, progress isn’t linear, life is about perpetual self-improvement. As long as you’re a better person than the day before, regardless of the avenue you’re looking to better yourself, you’re winning!

 

I salute you all!

 

RC: Great advice. Bodybuilding and a healthy lifestyle should be a lifelong commitment, but not necessarily at the same intensity level or with the same priorities. Thanks for chatting, Steve, and I look forward to seeing you in Orlando at the Olympia Weekend in November! 

 

VS: Sounds great!

 

Rick Collins, Esq., CSCS [https://rickcollins.com/] is the lawyer who members of the bodybuilding community and dietary supplement industry turn to when they need legal help or representation. [© Rick Collins, 2023. All rights reserved. For informational purposes only, not to be construed as legal or medical advice.]

 

[The views and opinions expressed in this interview do not necessarily reflect the views of musculardevelopment.com]

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